What is the best desktop client? #542
Replies: 12 comments 25 replies
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Good question. Currently I haven't found one - for me the problem is that I primarily use journals - tasks are well handled by a plethora of apps - one of jtxB's main benefits for tasks is to sync through a CalDAV server, so its disappointing to learn that you have problems syncing with Tbird and Evolution. I have used both as email & calendar clients and in themselves I found their tasks apps ok for laptop use but never managed to get them syncing well with a phone app. But basically I'm too disorganised to use a task app on any platform effectively anyway. For journals I don't have a desktop solution at all - there is (as yet) no linux app that works with a CalDAV server for Vcalendar journal entries without using a calendar interface. (probably the same on Win & Mac) What is needed is a dedicated Journal and Notebook program that is optimised for handling Journals (which typically you want to read like a book or diary and add entries at the end). There are plenty of notebook apps for Linux, but none I have found using VCalendar Vjournal entries (with no start date - which Patrick is cleverly using to distinguish between a journal/diary entry and a freestanding note in the absence of a VNOTE component in the spec) as a cross platform sync mechanism. jtxB is excellent for this - we just need a Linux app. My C is very rusty and I've never written a program on Linux (I started on MsDos). I used to do a lot of php before retiring a few years ago so I am playing with building a web based Journal and Notebook viewer using php. Slow progress but nearly usable and will at least enable me to read, edit, create, and sync entries from my laptop (when online) (or any browser on any platform). I'd love to hear what others are using,especially those who are using jtxB to keep a journal or diary, or as a note taking device. |
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Hey @digitaldissent , As @rogercreagh already mentioned, I'm also not aware of any installable alternatives. Theoretically you could install jtx Board on Linux (there is a "show and tell" discussion about this) using Waydroid. The backend itself shouldn't really make a difference... Radicale or Nextcloud, both should work properly. (In Nextcloud you would also have a web interface for tasks, but the functionality is very limited). Are you sure that your problem isn't just a sync setting issue? When looking at your description it looks more like the downwards sync from your server to thunderbird doesn't work properly. Or did you track it down to the behavior that only the completed status wasn't synchronized? But are you sure that there wasn't just |
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When looking at your description it looks more like the downwards sync from your server to thunderbird doesn't work properly Indeed it does, none of these issues seem to be coming from JTX but different types of tasks appear in the clients, but the tasks are not the same, some are one-time and some are reoccurring. I think I will setup Radicale locally and see how that works But 1st I found this -> https://github.com/flozz/calcleaner |
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@patrickunterwegs `Bad PUT request on '/user/8c697e24-b34c-25c4-2426-9dc2b0792806/d8aa7fbd-0333-4f0b-96d8-a6fca6247c7f.ics': Main component missing [2023-05-08 13:28:07 +0000] [6/Thread-1910 (process_request_thread)] [WARNING] Bad PUT request on '/user/8c697e24-b34c-25c4-2426-9dc2b0792806/d8aa7fbd-0333-4f0b-96d8-a6fca6247c7f.ics': Main component missing [2023-05-08 13:29:17 +0000] [6/Thread-1917 (process_request_thread)] [WARNING] Bad PUT request on '/user/8c697e24-b34c-25c4-2426-9dc2b0792806/d8aa7fbd-0333-4f0b-96d8-a6fca6247c7f.ics': can't compare offset-naive and offset-aware datetimes [2023-05-08 13:32:00 +0000] [6/Thread-2017 (process_request_thread)] [WARNING] Bad PUT request on '/user/8c697e24-b34c-25c4-2426-9dc2b0792806/d8aa7fbd-0333-4f0b-96d8-a6fca6247c7f.ics': can't compare offset-naive and offset-aware datetimes [2023-05-08 13:32:12 +0000] [6/Thread-2018 (process_request_thread)] [WARNING] Bad PUT request on '/user/8c697e24-b34c-25c4-2426-9dc2b0792806/d8aa7fbd-0333-4f0b-96d8-a6fca6247c7f.ics': Main component missing` |
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Hm, yes, that's interesting, maybe it's really just a broken entry that messes with the whole synchronization. Would you mind uploading this problematic .ics? (I mean only if it doesn't contain any sensitive data) |
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A little background information, I have been hosting my Nextcloud server for a few years and then migrated my Calendar to Radicale, so there are over 2,000 .ics files many are probably corrupted. I ran the CalDav cleaner I linked to above to remove all but the last two weeks. I did notice that clients would hold onto bad entries, I deleted those and so far things are working pretty well, I am going to monitor and see how things go. |
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Thanks for the update! Fingers crossed that the cleanup solved the issue for good 🤞😉 |
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Hi @ALL After various trials, I've found thunderbird to be the most convincing, because it displays tasks in the calendar... which also lets you "timeblock". However, I can't find a solution (either native or via add-ons) to retrieve my jtx memos/remarks in thunderbird (or even under linux in general). Any ideas? PS: Evolution does it, but it's a calamity for mail retrieval compared to thunderbird... |
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Hey, kOrganizer is the second Linux app that supports vjournal, but it's also very basic. Regrettably I can't recommend anything else and I'm not aware of any other solutions at the moment, but I hope others will follow. If there was a team that's not just me, I'd definitely consider trying an add-on for another application 😉 |
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You are already a star for your seemingly tireless work on this. Thank you so much. I appreciate how much work is involved making slow progress on my own vjournal joomla extension. Blooming well done. If anyone on here has any Thunderbird addon or Linux desktop app dev knowledge we would be happy to help with advice and experience from other platforms using CalDAV clients. Even drafting a requirements spec would be a start... |
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Hi @patrickunterwegs and @rogercreagh
Yes, of course I understand completely. I agree that the work done is already brilliant and much appreciated. Personally, I'd be very happy with a Thunderbird addon, but I think some users would prefer a dedicated desktop application (flatpak). In terms of note-taking software, I know that Qownnotes lets you sync caldav tasks, but that's pretty basic too.
Unfortunately I have no development skills in this area. From my point of view, the advantage of a desktop application would be to be able to retrieve notes in markdown format in a folder. This would make it possible to use these notes in documentation management applications such as Logseq, Obsidian, Qownnotes, etc. But I'll have to take a look at Vdirsyncer, which was mentioned above, to see if we can achieve anything with it concerning notes or even journal entries. |
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Hi, I have managed to sync thunderbird too. It works for tasks, but notes are not there. |
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I found the solution to my syncing with Korganiser issues here: https://jtx.techbee.at/troubles-with-the-synchronization-see-what-could-go-wrong RTFM, yeah, I know 🫢 I needed to create a new calendar with all the necessary entry types. It was very easy to do with DAVx⁵. A nice advantage of working closely together I guess. |
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Hey, sorry for the late reply, but you figured it out anyway :-) I hope now it works smoothly :-) |
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Thunderbird is good and pretty fast with syncing but regrettably doesn't support subtasks. Everything is piled together. |
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Hi, can people who use jtx on their phones and want access on desktop please share their workflows? I am still looking for a good solution. I am on Linux.
The most important things for me are notes and tasks with hierarchy of sub-tasks. Without the sub-tasks my to-dos get too long, and I have no overview. Ideally I would have everything in one application, but 2 small apps would be fine. I do not really want to use 2 big programmes like say Korganizer and Evolution. One or two tabs in my browser would also be fine. |
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Did you need to do something specific to make it work with Korganizer? Mine shows up empty of journals entries even though I have plenty in my Nextcloud which is synchronized with DAV |
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It's been a few months, any new ideas? How do you edit your journals on desktop? |
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You may be interested in #1554 |
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Hey folks, if anybody needs a work around gnome evolution technically supports all things, including journals. It treats notes and journals as the same and from what I can tell VJOURNAL is used for both - the difference being journal entries (that show up as such in jtx) have the date set. To convert a note to a journal entry just add the date. To convert a journal entry to a note, remove the date. I am not sure how to convert to and from tasks though. I hope this helps folks, I haven't found a better desktop linux tool yet myself for CALDAV sync of contacts, notes, calendars, tasks and journal entries yet. No decent web solutions either. |
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@edwin-jones I'm trying Evolution. If a task is created in jtxBoard or Evolution, is it shown in the other application as well? Doesn't seem to work for me. |
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Sorry. Tasks are working fine, I confused an appointment in the calendar as a task. I would love to see tasks in the calendar. that's not posible, right? |
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Not that's I'm aware of but I don't use them. I can create tasks in evolution and see them in jtx and vice versa though. |
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The problem with showing a task in a calendar is the structure of the VEVENT and VTODO, while the VEVENT MUST have a DTSTART and a DTEND date/time (where systems can rely that they are always present), the VTODO CAN have a DTSTART, DUE and COMPLETED date/time. |
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I haven't tried it (yet) but if you are on linux then I believe KDE Organizer which runs on the KDE Plasma desktop does handle VJOURNAL entries. I'm on Ubuntu 24.04 and it says you can install KDE plasma desktop in parallel with Gnome (the default) and switch between them. I'm thinking I might give it a go... |
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Yes I've been using kOrganizer and it works well. The user interface takes a little bit to get used to, but once you understand how to switch from calendars to journals and displays everything in a weekly or monthly manner it is super useful. |
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Thanks - I'll def give it a go. |
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kOrganiser works but it doesn't handle all the other things. If all you need is journals it's probably the best desktop option but I'm on Ubuntu so I prefer native gnome apps. |
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Yep, I can confirm that Korganiser/Kontact can be installed and work on Ubuntu 24.04.1 with the standard gnome desktop, so no need to switch to full KDE (although there may be advantages to doing that) The showstopper for me is that it doesn't seem to use or display or edit Categories (tags) which are essential for organising a large collection of journal entries. |
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Meanwhile one day I'll get back to my half completed Journal extension for joomla which will give ma a browser tab view of Journals and notes (but not tasks - there are other apps for them and for me tasks are a completely different application than journals - tasks are about what you are planning to do, journals are about recording what you' did. For me I'd prefer JtxB didn't waste its time with tasks, and concentrated on its original purpose - handling VJOURNAL events well. |
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Hello everyone, I just started using CalDav as I'm trying getting my personal accounts out of Google. In searching for CalDav clients I found jtxBoard, it looked very interesting, and so of course in following the white rabbit I found this thread. I'd like to add where I'm at and see if anyone has recently come up with a good workflow for vjournal specifically that includes mobile and desktop. Tasks and events seem to be handled well by other apps. Unfortunately my new mail provider (Mailbox.org) doesn't seem to support vjournal with their CalDav server. So I've set up Radicale just on my laptop and am syncing that with Davx5, and using vdirsyncer to pull the .ics files into a folder on the laptop. At this point I think all I need is a nicer interface to create/edit the vjournal .ics files (though I could just edit them directly I suppose). |
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Maybe it's no coincidence but I've been leaning this way as well after looking at options today. I already use Emacs for most text editing. I've been trialing Thunderbird for mail and calendar just because in the past putting everything (tm) in Emacs has been a bit much. I think Emacs combined with vdirsyncer could work well (and indeed someone wrote a package called cdsync to integrate CalDav with Emacs diary). However the big find of the day was that someone has written an icalendar parser recently meant to improve upon the existing parsers in Emacs. You can find discussion on emacs-devel and the repo is at https://git.sr.ht/~wyleyr/icalendar-el. He also wrote a long post on it here https://recursewithless.net/emacs/icalendar-parser-and-mode.org. Also no worries on tone and I appreciate the info! This landscape is something of a mess it seems and any info is helpful. |
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Interesting finds, but if I am reading it correctly, sadly not the end yet, but knowing how easy it is to write custom functions and views in emacs, it's just a matter of a few pages worth of elisp code to add the functionality. Rendering a view will be the hardest, but as said, I want to build off existing implementations. If I see that correctly, the cdsync is just an alternative to orgmode - ical sync. The icalendar parser is more interesting as it creates syntax highlighting for the file itself and it does mention vJournal once. As said, I don't think, if you have a massive file, that having just a list of entries is really usable, at least my brain just wants to see parts of it and that parser doesn't make it accessible to org roam at all. We need a viewer, also in Calendar view, a sync component, and I want to recreate jtx boards features of toggling vNotes into vJournals and vice versa and associate vNotes with vTasks and events etc. I am working on an overengineered emacs based CRM with communication logs, objects with RDF entities that partially syncs with my CalDAV server, so I can access the most important part of the data in any app. Sadly I am just at the modelling stage, so this will take A WHILE. |
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Just wanted to point that on Dekstop linux I've been using kOrganizer since I stumbled upon this very thread of discussion and the more I use it, the more I like it. It takes a little bit of getting used to but now I use it fully for all my calendars, following calendars from other people or third places events, editing my journal entries etc. |
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Interesting @Julianoe - I am almost the reverse, At present I only use Kontact to be able to view and partially edit journal entries, but use other apps on linux for calendar, email, tasks etc. I wonder if you are trying to create/edit entries on a phone - I have a dedicated tablet with a e-ink screen for journals (jtxB) and books (kindle) and drawingi notes (a built in boox app) and find jtxB perfectly good for editing journals on a handheld device - I couple of quirks that could be ironed out (layout of tag/category selection when editing being the biggest bugbear - there was an issue for this but nothing has happened, probably because the focus now seems to be on Tasks, which is a shame as there are plenty of alternative tasks app, but none for journals. I agree a phone is not ideal for creating/editing entries (or anything else come to that!) For me, the biggest problem with Kontact/Korganiser for journals is that tags/categories are only shown in the edit screen and you filtering/search on them is buried a few layers away. It may be that there are config setting for this but I haven't found them. |
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Guys, respectfully, you are in the side thread. This doesn't relate to it. Go back to the main discussion if at all. |
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I'd like to know what the recommended (Linux)desktop client is; none that I have tried work well for me. I tried using Nextcloud as a backend and then synched to Kmail and Thunderbird. Tasks would "pile up" in my email client and not sync properly. I could add a task from my email client, and it would sync to Jtx; then, if I checked it done in Jtx, it would never be marked done in Thunderbird/Kmail. Tasks just seem to get stuck and then pile up. If I created and then complete a task in Jtx it might sync all that to Thunderbird or get stuck as an open task or maybe get stuck as a completed task.
I moved to Radicale as a backend, and now with Thunderbird and Evolution, the same issues. Evolution works a little better.
I am not getting any errors in my clients, and I am on Jtx 2.4
What are people using as desktop clients? Jtx alone is fine, but I want to use my laptop : /
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